Disgruntledpatriot's Blog

September 9, 2009

Democratic Underground Proves Itself Part of the Problem

Filed under: Sick and Tired — Trever Bierschbach @ 3:17 pm
Tags: , ,

Yesterday I talked about a post I had read at democraticunderground.com, and another post caught my eye there.  Now let me first say that Democratic Underground is a private site, that can really do whatever it wants.  I am not begrudging them that.  The post that I saw is here.  My original post was deleted, but in essence I was commenting on the problem that is keeping Americans from having discussions about politics because of the partisan fighting, and how the media is contributing to this.  Because I happened to use the name Glenn Beck, because one of the characters in the cartoon looked like him, many posters at this site focused only on that and not on the actual issue.  Well if you go there you can see that much of it went back and forth, and it got way off topic.  Some people, very few actually, agreed that what I was talking about was a problem, but most just wanted to call names, accuse me of lying intentionally, or unintentionally, question my identity, and a slew of other hateful things, all the while accusing me of spreading hate.

That leads me to today.  Now, yesterday afternoon I ended my participation in a clearly futile discussion and bowed out.  I returned today to see if anyone had anything new to offer, but without the intention of answering to any more posts.  I learned that my original post had been deleted, and by clicking on the link I found out why.

2. Who We Are: Democratic Underground is an online community for Democrats and other progressives. Members are expected to be generally supportive of progressive ideals, and to support Democratic candidates for political office. Democratic Underground is not affiliated with the Democratic Party, and comments posted here are not representative of the Democratic Party or its candidates.”

Now like I said, they are a private site, and have every right to do whatever they want.  What I would like to point out is that this is the primary reason we have such a problem with partisan politics and political discussion that only ends in arguments.  If a group of people subject themselves only to their own beliefs it soon takes on the element of faith, much like religion.  If anyone so much as proposes an alternate idea, the whole community erupts into flames, and hate.  Yes, hate.  Democrats are not above it either.

Now, I had not yet attempted to log in, but when I did I found out that my rights to post had been revoked as well.  Why are opposing views so hated as to be banned from the eyes of one group of people?  I invited people from this site to visit here if they would like to continue the civil discussion that was started there, and that invitation is still open.  Sadly I don’t expect much traffic from there.  I feel that when we isolate ourselves from outside ideas we consign ourselves to a stagnant and ignorant existence.

I thought about answering some of the topics that were brought up here, but I don’t see the point.  The left wants to call the right racists, the right calls the left elitist pansies.  I see more references to race on leftist sites, and I see more ignorance on the right.  Fact of the matter is those don’t represent the norm, just the loudest.  I firmly believe that the majority sits firmly in the middle, right on top of the core American Values, and the only time they stand up and shout is when their leaders start to walk away from those values.  I just really wish that people could ignore parties, ignore media, ignore politicians and talk to each other.

Some of the DU users directed me to Free Republic, saying I would be more welcome there, even saying I should ‘shout some racist remarks’ to show that I am one of them.  While I find that idea repugnant, and that poster to be exactly the problem I am talking about, I did visit that site today for a minute or so.  I found it to be just as bad to the other side as DU, but with one glaring difference.  I did not find anything in their rules that restrict the posts, or membership to be from one political ideology.  So while the party of acceptance and tolerance is telling people with dissenting ideas to stay away, the party of hate and racism (sarcasm there) at least allows everyone to express their opinion.

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September 8, 2009

Seriously, Do Democrats Really Believe They Are Better People?

Filed under: Sick and Tired — Trever Bierschbach @ 9:46 am
Tags: , , , ,

Ok, I was looking up information on Indiana Congressman Baron Hill, and what he said in a town hall meeting on Sept 2.  If you haven’t seen it, there are a lot of sites out there that cover it.  Basically he is an arrogant politician that has forgotten who he works for.  While I was doing this I stumbled upon a website called democraticunderground.com.  After reading a post on this site, which I will link to in a second, I realized that some democrats are just as bad as some republicans, but the problem is no one is pointing this out.  While politicians and media claim that ‘teabaggers’ and health care opponents are organized by big business, this site actually has people suggesting that health care supporters lie when they go to town hall meetings.  What the media, and supporters are failing to point out is we all want reform, what the conservatives don’t want is government control, but many of the other reform plans seem to be good ideas.  What the opponents of the current incarnation of the bill are failing to point out are things that they would like to see in the bill as well.  What both groups are failing to point out, is that we are being led around by the nose by politicians and media, and we should realise that we have more in common than not.  We need to get together on this, figure out what we want, and agree.  Once the people agree the politicians will have no choice but to follow along.

Ok, so here is the link.  Now, when I talked about supporters suggesting that town hall attendees lie, I mean this one…

“Or, pose as a physician and state that you have to spend more time arguing with insurance company accountants to get a needed procedure covered than actually treating patients. Say that you had a patient who actually died while waiting for insurance company approval.”

Now, let’s get this straight.  ‘Teagabbers’ are liars, mobs, astroturf, and nazis, but here is a democrat site, suggesting that other democrats lie at a town hall meeting and ‘pose’ as a doctor to make a question seem more important.

Here is another one that shows the problem with the debate…

“They talk about the “death panels” that will come with health reform. There really are “death panels” now…the insurance companies. They decide if they want to help you or not – more often times it’s not.”

How can we have an honest debate, when something that was obviously misunderstood keeps getting brought up by liberals.  Let’s get past the death panels, and talk about what is really an issue.  There is a lot more in this site, that just makes me sick, but the glaring fact is that instead of focusing on the fact that we all want change, they focus on how to make opponents look bad.  Isn’t it possible for us all to agree that this is something we want, we just have two different visions on how it should look?  Many of these post get just plain insulting.  Look, I have read a lot of the bill, I have researched the things that are in it.  I agree that some of it might work, and if it does it will make things better.  What I don’t agree with is that the public option is one of those.  If we can come to a compromise, that pushes reform without takeover, and install more reform like fixing malpractice problems, we would have a great reform bill.

PEOPLE, stop listening to politicians and media and start listening to each other.  We all agree on about 90% of this issue, but because we are letting party politics drive a wedge between us we can’t come together on it.  Talk to each other without insults.  Have civil discourse without throwing in stereotypes and hate.  Please, don’t let this issue die because we can’t come to a compromise.

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